Cincy Jungle

hell i'm reading way too much into the tea leaves

my initial thought was, omg, the bengals are serious about scouting the best pulling guard in the draft. bringing in mcnally to find and school the next Max Montoya!

Damn U just read my mind Another scout

DiddyGotGrillz - February 22, 2012 reply

Nice

Outstanding Move !

77CincyRage - February 22, 2012 reply

Alexandar is a McNally guy

Alexandar learned how to coach o-line from McNally.

lbacker2179 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

WOAH - "Consultant"

Settle down there Mike – we wouldn’t want anyone to think you’re actually listening to anyone’s advice. LOL!

(Actually, I think MB has done a pretty decent job with personnel moves over the last three years or so, but I just couldn’t resist.)

Maybe he will tell Alexander that Livings is bad

and that he should let Smith or Collins play at guard. Gotta get the best 5 linemen out there! Consult away!

Luke - February 22, 2012 reply

We are preparing ourselves for a dream team

We are going ALL IN this year. We signed McNally and Hue to also assist with scouting and player development. So this tells me we are going to be actively looking for secondary and o-line in free agency/draft.

I just gotta gut feeling we are going to see a major overhaul in the roster. A lot of moves are gonna be made day 1 of free agency up until first week of season. Keep a eye out on these players being released(Clements, Peko, Rey, Crocker, Geathers and Leonard ).

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

You actually may not be totally of base on SOME of the names you mentioned

But I can almost guarantee Clements isn’t going anywhere

johnson_cody_18 - February 22, 2012 reply

Get rid of Peko, Leonard, Clements?

WHY?

Peko is paid like a top 5 DT

When he’s actually a top 35 or so DT. No way he earns his contract. I’d rather have Atkins & Sims in there than either & Peko.

Peko isn’t bad, don’t get me wrong, I just don’t think he’s as good a pass rusher as Atkins or as good a run stuffer as Sims. He’s certainly not an elite DT, but his contract says otherwise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huolfNTLgB0

peko still has a place in cincy's heart for the hit

agreed though, he’s paid well, probably a little too well. atkins is younger and better. simms, who i love against the run, might not be durable enough to give you 16 games a season as a starter. peko is dependable. glad he’s a bengal. leadership material too. i know he’s not a stellar DT.

idk why your so hard on Peko

Peko is much like Geathers, where they don’t get the sexy stats, but they do control the line and gaps for the LBs and safeties to fill in.

Thats his specialty controling the line. Peko and Atkins work beautifully together

AMAS85 - February 22, 2012 reply

Peko eats the Double blocks

Geathers Set the edge

I like Peko, I really do

I’m just sick of seeing him get pushed around. FAR too often there’s a single o-lineman pushing Peko backwards. I hate seeing that. We need DTs that take 2 o-linemen to block, not a guy that gets pushed around one-on-one.

Peko has gotten better, slightly, but he’s still just “pretty good”.

Agree about his attitude and work ethic, he seems like a great guy. I just wish he was a better DT.

yea, i know what you mean sometimes, but in terms of atleticism for a DT (i know, sounds like an oxymoron)

Peko is up there.

Im sure we should be looking into his replacement sooner than later because he will eventually become more of a role player in the next couple of years.

I think he will be the starter until his contract is up, but we will probably keep him as veteran back up, kinda like what we are going to do with Geathers.

AMAS85 - February 22, 2012 reply

I think he is a guy we need on this team.

He is pretty solid and has the right attitude. Does a lot in the community. He is a team guy and a good mentor and player, IMO.

I'm right there with you

His attitude is absolutely perfect. Off the field he sounds like a guy you REALLY want on your team. He’s just not great on the field. He’s pretty good, but by no means elite.

Peko is most certainly NOT paid like a Top 5 DT. Not even close

Guys, when talking about player contracts, it’s good not to just throw numbers out there.

There are plenty of on-line sources which provide detailed contract information about all NFL players.

One such site, is here.

As you can see, Peko is due to earn a base salary of $3,375,000.00 USD in 2012 (plus some incentives which are capped at only an additional $200,000 if he reaches them).

Peko’s 2012 base salary currently ranks him 15th (i.e. no where near Top 5) for DTs in the league. And this doesn’t include some UFA defensive tackles that will get sizeable contracts this offseason (Broderick Bunckley to name but one) which will drive up the average DT base salary, and which will further drive down Peko’s #15th place in that list.

Spotrac.com is a great website. Spending a few hours on the site and seeing how things like a Signing Bonus is pro-rated over the life of a contract is REALLY< REALLY helpful in understanding how the NFL salary cap works.

Bottom line: Peko is going nowhere and gladly so. He is the leader of that d-line, and possibly that entire defense. Remember he and Big Whit were the ones that TOOK IT UPON THEMSELVES to organize team practices during last season’s lockout. That type of “stuff” cannot be overlooked or undervalued. Team chemistry is critically important, and is often times more important than talent (just as the “Dream Team” Eagles from last season).

http://whodeyrevolution.typepad.com/whodeyrevolution/2008/06/peko-highest-pa.html

Weird that the salary would be less this year than it was first couple years

This link refers to what makes me think of Peko as being paid top-notch money:

At the time it was reported that his contract made him the highest paid d-lineman in the league. If he’s down to under 3.5mil now after over 8mil the first year, then that’s a pretty damn weird contract.

its all based on how the contract is structured

Most contracts now pay big upfront (cause who knows what next year will bring) and then starts to get smaller or maintains a smaller cap hit per year. You got paid upfrond now play.

(which ends up in a lot of hold outs even though they already got paid)

Highest paid DT at the time, possibly. Remember, though, that he signed that contract 5 years ago already.

That is a very long time in NFL contracts.

Moreoever, I don’t entirely trust WDR. Even though they link to the USA today, remember that the contract was signed 5 years ago ( a very, very long time for NFL contracts).

With regard to the $8M Peko earned in the first year, that total is not just his base salary. It is is salary plus all other bonuses earned, which led him to $8M. Not sure why Spotrac didn’t include this, but sometimes the Bengals don’t release all the details of their contracts, especially regarding bonuses.

Take a look at Jahri Evan contract. He re-signed with the Saints in 2010 for 7-years/$56.7M (an average of $8.1M). However, with the way bonuses can be pro-rated, it’s not as if the player’s yearly average – $8.1M in Evans’ case – will be the actual cap hit for every year of the contract. In fact, look at Evan’s base salary in 2012. It is actually substantially lower than his yearly average, and so is his cap hit. The cap hit (while lower than the pure $8.1M average) is also higher than the base salary because of pro-rating the signing bonus.

Sorry – here is Jahri Evans’ contract

i do agree we need to keep peko around

his contract is hardly breaking the bengals. even if peko sat on the bench as depth, he’d be welcomed. peko is a good leadership guy.

6/13/2008: Signed a seven-year, $30.3 million contract. The deal includes $8.5 million guaranteed.
2011: $3.1 million,
2012: $3.175 million,
2013: $3.3 million,
2014: $3.525 million,
2015: Free Agent

i'm a fan of rotoworld for contract details

ok, point made

His contract doesn’t outweigh his contribution, I was wrong. I still would like someone that doesn’t get pushed around like he does, but there’s not a single thing you can say negative about the guy’s attitude or leadership.

i'm with you on feeling like we overpay peko

i’m also happy to have peko on the team. guy appears to be a solid role model for the younger guys, he’s always positive about the team in his statements, and appears to be a solid leader. i do agree he gets knocked around inside from time to time.

i’d be happy to keep him just to sit on the bench when he’s nfl old (32+). i’d like to see peko retire a bengal, after spending his whole career in cincy.

palewook - February 23, 2012 reply

Clements- basically is TOO slow for 4mil only good if we played a lot of zone, which we don’t like playing. For his 4mil we could re sign Pac-Man and draft cb in first. Then we have money to really be aggressive trying sign Grimes or Carr. If not Clements look for team to ask Hall to restructure his contract.

Peko- Highest paid player on d-line and might be the weakest link. I’m dreaming but with cutting him we could try to sign M. Williams. Add 3 mil to what Peko make and u could sign Williams.

Leonard- Gruden is pretty much outspoken and I’ve never heard him mention Leonards name. That’s not good and he didn’t see feild all that much last year. To me he’s our best back but I guess he might be too slow for Gruden.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Keep leonard

Hes a work horse

I think he’s the starter were looking for. Never seen 1 negative play from Leonard.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Pray u r on fire today!

Leonard always tries to get that extra yard

thanks

Just always giving my HONEST opinion… I call it how I see it. Never seen one negative play from dude. He’s a fighter for real.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Yeah Leonard Starter

Someone Like Hillis (someone Like) for the short yardage and goal line sit’s

and then trent richardson lol

LOVE the guy.

He fights for extra yards, first downs, etc. Unlike some other former (hopefully) players on this team.

You mean like the guy that goes down at the slightest contact?

What is his name? I can’t recall…a TV show late 70’s-early 80’s…what is his name….. (PS. Totally being sarcastic…) :)

HAHA!!

Yeah, can’t remember the guy’s name. Same guy who almost fumbled away a crucial game for us. Some lame-o.

Perfect 4 WCO

And the boy lays people out blocking esp when dalton drops back on 3rd down. Wait no one is open? Dump it to him. I cant remember him ever dropping a pass

I agree,

Leonard would be perfect for a WCO…He can run it, and he can catch it, unlike Cedric “please don’t pass it to me” Benson….

Big Sky Bengal - February 22, 2012 reply

Peko

I think Marvin prefers to reward leadership and reliability. Too many times, the organization has rewarded brief bursts of performance by players that aren’t reliable and definitely aren’t leaders.

Peko is our leader on D. We’ve tried to bring that in via FA, but it’s rarely lasted long (Dhani being our best success in that area), and I think Marvin values a home-grown team player. He’s tried to introduce it artificially, he knows it usually doesn’t work like that. Peko may not be a star, but I think he’s a Marvin-type productive, trustworthy player.

ok

But that doesn’t mean just because your a leader you get paid like All-Pro. Your right on about that’s how Marvin runs things. Benson and Crocker were Marvin type of signings also. Marvin gave Benson too much credit for his breakout year. I mean come on Marvin dude was a top 5 pick he was supposed to be able to do that.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Although, Peko should be an all-pro...

he just does not get enough recognition. Peko has been close a few times, but has not gotten the trip to Hawaii yet….

Peko plays the unsexy 4-3 DT

but he plays it well..

Pat sims is the better run stuff though.

+1

As I said

I can see some of the moves you have mentioned but I think they are still very high on Clements and even if they do draft a rookie, I still think they would keep him around for his vetran leadership, especially with only 1 more year on his contract

Not being funny but we had all 5 year or more experience in NFL in secondary except guys that didn’t play. Last year was basically his first time on a winning team in NFL. So what makes you think Clements brings veteran leadership?

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Just because you've been on bad teams

Does not mean you cannot be a leader. I’m just trying to point out that I can actually see some of the moves you proposed happening but Clements will not be one of them IMO. We are to thin at CB, he’s better than serviceable and most importantly he only has 1 year left on his deal. That’s why I think THEY will choose to retain him

Cause a Dude towards the end of his career wants one thing

TO Win.

when thats your goal it help motivates those around you

how about this

We keep Clements, resign Pac man, grab a FA CB and draft a CB(or two). We have more than enough cash for all that.
I just can’t see them letting Clements go. His work ethic was second to none. Guys talked about it all the time. They even talked about how getting him to a play off was one of their motivations. The guy is a keeper. Production wise, I agree he might not be worth his salary but we need someone like him to help with the young CB(s) we assume the Bengals will be drafting this year. Would you rather they learn from Clements or from Pac Man?

+1000

Not only do I think that is what they should do but it is also what I think they will do and the other nice think with Clements is it gives us added insurance for Leon Hall. I do like the idea of picking up another one in FA and drafting 2 this year

You forgot about Hall

I just can’t see us paying two cb’s 12mil if neither is guaranteed to start. And its cool to learn from veteran player but we just hired two new db coaches they should be learning from. Either Hall or Clements will be released. If Hall restructure his contract then I’ll rather keep both. Sign Grimes and draft Jenkins/Barron.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

I am in the camp that thinks Hall will not be back at anything close to what he was prior to this injury. I don’t think anyone knows what to expect yet. Clements has 1 year left on his deal, I just don’t see them letting him go with all the uncertanty of the Hall inury.

If you "Add 3 mil to Peko's salary in order to sign Williams" as you state, then Mario Williams will be the biggest steal in the history of NFL free agency

Adding $3M to Peko’s 2012 base salary will mean Mario Williams will earn $6.375M in 2012 – that’s beyond a bargain!!!!

You’ll see that Mario will most likely earn QUADRUPLE Peko’s very modest $3.375M salary in 2012.

Not sure where this talk of Peko being a TOP 5 paid DT came from.

You’re not getting highest paid salary for DE coming off injury. We can sign Williams for 7 mil.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

why would the release leonard

the most productive RB per carry we have… (plus i think we have to resign him before we can cut him)

Maybe TJ was right

“Dream team” of coaches:)

Dare I say, A consultant for the o-line may be another way of saying a talent evaluator for offensive lineman. Maybe now we won’t let anymore pro bowl calliber guards walk out the door (I’m looking at you Alexander).

alexander is under contract until 01/2013

i can dream though.

fire alexander. promote McNally please!

after letting mathis get away

and the general decline of the OL.

I would say this guy could be here to evaulate how PA is doing

that would make me very happy

johnson_cody_18 - February 22, 2012 reply

Another great hire

I’m really loving this offseason so far, hopefully they can keep it going.

Our coaching staff is effing loaded.

Now can we just load up some key spots this off-season.

TCfromDubVee - February 22, 2012 reply

Okay, is this Marvin having more say in things...

or is Katie taking charge?

who knows, who cares.

i’m optimistically grateful that alexander might have someone looking over his shoulder in 2012, other than the fans.

Both

And to be honest I believe its more of a group than just them two individuals.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

+1

+1

GREAT HIRE!:)

One of the best in the NFL! way to go! WHODEY!!!

Makebelieve - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Totally agree.

Just another move to make me wonder what is going on around here?? Keep it up.

Big Sky Bengal - February 22, 2012 reply

Wow

That’s more than I thought we’d do to address OL coaching. From what I’ve read about this, it’ll be a limited role, but I hope he helps us with scouting.

Objectivity

McNally can view team personnel with out prejudice and be objective about current players, available FA’s and upcoming draft candidates. Alexander keeps repeating the same tunnel vision mistakes on his favorites. This move more than ever tells me MB & ML are serious about developing a winning tradition. Great move!

sofakingood - February 22, 2012 reply

Watch how active we be when free agency begins.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Can't wait.

You know he may have had a hand in drafting Anthony Munoz. Anybody know? If so it goes to show how adept his judgement could be in this years’ draft.

sofakingood - February 22, 2012 reply

if anything you have to credit mcnally with montoya

max was solid but not a pro-bowl caliber player. around 81 max starting pulling better and better. he developed into one of the best pulling guards in the 80s nfl. doing that job for years in cincy, until oakland overpaid to steal max away when he was an old vet.

Don't remember who drafted Anthony Munoz

but it was one Mike Brown who nearly threw away the chance to sign him. He was doing the contract negotiations then, tried as hard as he could to low-ball Munoz, and called him a “big taco” in the press. I think now Katie is nearly as cheap but at least she doesn’t call people names insensitively.

dingle - February 23, 2012 reply

WOW

well you can say Who Dey Revolution This Year!!

Now The If The Bengals make 2-3 splashes in Free Agency
get a #1WR/#2WR Opposite of AJ Green
get a all pro guard Nicks/Grubbs
get a back-up TE
get a DB (Finnegan,Porter,Ross,Thomas)

Draft
a G if not address in FA
a DB
a RB

A new primetime WR go mess up team chemistry. Keep who we have, there all smart dependable receivers. Aj and Gresh might be teams worst route runners and they are still our teams best receivers. That’s not a knock on them but Hawk, Shipley, Whalen are as smart as it can get playing WR.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

I see your point

Hawk, Shipley, Whalen none of them have the speed to be a true #2 WR. Todays NFL you really need two speed guys. I see those three as all slot receivers.

The top passing teams in NFL feature only one true burner(Meachem). Green is faster than Saints, Packers, Indy and NE #1 receiver. All them teams have smart dependable WR that run perfect routes. Hawkins might be faster than Green by the way so he’s not all that slow.either. Dalton struggles throwing deep so we don’t want him throwing ball down feild all game either.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Saints conist of a lot of #2WR and Slot WR

but Drew Brees and the O-line makes them look so good and so does Sean Payton

Right on

So does Packers. And Gruden said that’s two teams he’s been watching on film.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

should do great, with a few addition to our O-line, we can have Gresham killing down the seam

and Shipley running over the middle and Marvin Jones opposite of AJ Green

OK Chili

I don’t see where Dalton struggles on the deep throws. He’s obviouslt not perfect and missed a couple opportunities but he completed a ton of deep passes this year and he’s only a rookie.

no just a #1WR from another team to become our #2WR like Johnson and Colston and Wayne

DiddyGotGrillz - February 22, 2012 reply

And ur wish list is perfect

Were gonna get Nicks or Grubbs so plugg a dt in with one of our 1st rd picks.

pray4gm11 - February 22, 2012 via mobile reply

Just read the fine print....

It will only be for a couple days.

“McNally, 68, adds the Bengals to his growing list of camps and clinics he conducts throughout the year. While continuing to live in Buffalo, McNally plans to stop in Cincinnati for a couple of days during the offseason, spring camp, and training camp while doing mostly film work.”

lol

Dammit, you killed our good vibe with facts…….

So he's more like another scout

And and/or talent evaluator. With out track record I’m still really happy with the addition

What I want to know is...

Who is that o-lineman standing next to McNally? He looks badass. Sign him at least for camp competition!!

DTFCPDX - February 22, 2012 reply

Was thinking the same thing LOL

Jason Peters?

im guessing that pick is from his time in buffalo sense then peters went to the eagles

this is my guess.

guy reminds me of Jason Shirley.